<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span">I fully agree with Susan. </SPAN><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><SPAN class="Apple-style-span">In addition, I am opposed to any winner-take-all system, whether by state or by congressional district. Neither represents the diversity of the people. I would like to see proportional representation based in grassroots participatory democracy. There are excellent models for that in practice in South America. A description of one such model is in a book recommended to me by Noam Chomsky, <I>Lula and the Workers' Party</I>. The book also does a good job of describing how to build a base of support for a party seeking to challenge the parties in power.</SPAN><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><SPAN class="Apple-style-span"> Dana Silvernale</SPAN></DIV><DIV><SPAN class="Apple-style-span">Humboldt Green Party</SPAN></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><SPAN class="Apple-style-span"> <BR><DIV><DIV>On Sep 21, 2007, at 4:23 PM, <A href="mailto:funking@mindspring.com">funking@mindspring.com</A> wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">I sent out a query a few weeks ago about this, after getting a media call wanting our reaction.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">The points I made were:</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">1) This does nothing to promote Green party backed election reforms, such as the implementation of Ranked Choice Voting and Proportional Representation;</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">2) A possible negative effect on the CA GP would be the spreading of the spoiler issue around the presidential race to the Congressional District level, which COULD impact our ability to run successful local campaigns and win (in other words, people would not vote for local Greens if they were pissed off/scared about the Presidential candidate potentially 'spoiling' the race their home Congressional district).<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">3) Republicans are already over represented in both Federal houses, due to the fact that many red states are sparsley populated and each Congresperson represents far fewer voters than those in large states. In CA and NY, Congres folk represent upwards of a million constituents per district, compared with a few hundred thousand in places like WY. We need a system that accurately reflects the electorate, including representation for independent and third party voters. <SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">4) Retooling our Electoral College is a good idea, but this measure does not overhaul the entire system, and focuses only on the nations largest state. Greens support a complete electoral reform program, not a piece-meal project that does not address the disparities faced by third parties.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">In short, I spoke against this measure. We do not have a fully fleshed out position yet, but the above talking points may be a good place to start. I will contact Steven Hill and others at the Center for Voting and Democracy to see if they have any other salient points.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">peace,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">ssuan</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">-----Original Message-----</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">From: Drew Johnson <<A href="mailto:JamBoi@Greens.org">JamBoi@Greens.org</A>></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Sent: Sep 21, 2007 3:01 PM</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">To: <A href="mailto:gpus-del@lists.cagreens.org">gpus-del@lists.cagreens.org</A>, <A href="mailto:cal-forum@marla.cagreens.org">cal-forum@marla.cagreens.org</A></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Subject: [G-C-F] Fwd: GPCA position on electoral votes by congressional<SPAN class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </SPAN>district???</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Carl Romanelli, 2006 U.S. Senate candidate of the GP of PA asks the</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">question of the GPCA:</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">What is the California Green Party position (if any) regarding the</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">proposal to award electoral votes by congressional district, rather than</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">winner take all? I really like the congressional district idea, as I see</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">it as a way for</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Greens to gain electoral votes with the right candidate.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">I am aware of the Dems fear tactics {on this issus} and we SHOULD scare</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">them.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>We should work for our goals, not theirs.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>After the clear and</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">distinct pattern of Dems working to destroy us, we should not care that</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">they may not elect their corporate candidate.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>If California is successful</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">in gaining electoral votes for Greens, we can then make the case for CD</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">based propositions in other states.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>At least awarding by CD is somewhat</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">proportional.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Further, it may turn out that the Green electors from</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">California are the ones who decide who the next president will be.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>That</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">would be a great accomplishment for the party.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>I really want the</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Democrats to be afraid of us.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Passing this in California would really</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">freak them out.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>That would be cool with me. Maybe then they would stop</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">kicking us.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Worse still is when we let them.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Subject: Re: California Question</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">From:<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>"Carl Romanelli" <<A href="mailto:cjromanellii@yahoo.com">cjromanellii@yahoo.com</A>></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Date:<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Fri, September 21, 2007 14:34</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">To:<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>"Drew Johnson" <<A href="mailto:JamBoi@Greens.org">JamBoi@Greens.org</A>></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">--------------------------------------------------------------------------</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Yes, please forward the question.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>I am aware of the Dems fear tactics and</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">we SHOULD scare them.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>We should work for our goals, not theirs.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>After</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">the clear and distinct pattern of Dems working to destroy us, we should</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">not care that they may not elect their corporate candidate.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>If California</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">is successful in gaining electoral votes for Greens, we can then make the</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">case for CD based propositions in other states.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>At least awarding by CD</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">is somewhat proportional.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Further, it may turn out that the Green</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">electors from California are the ones who decide who the next president</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">will be.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>That would be a great accomplishment for the party.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>I really</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">want the Democrats to be afraid of us.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Passing this in California would</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">really freak them out.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>That would be cool with me. Maybe then they would</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">stop kicking us.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Worse still is when we let them. Thanks for your help,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Drew.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Blessings and love,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Carl</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Drew Johnson <<A href="mailto:JamBoi@Greens.org">JamBoi@Greens.org</A>> wrote:</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN>Hey Carl,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Personally I like the idea especially if it were applied in several of the</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">large states simultaneously, but I have to say there's been a LOT of</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Dmocratic fear mongering about it in this state. I don't really know what</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">the thoughts of the delegation are on that. I'd be willing to forward</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">your question on to the delegation if you want me to. Do you want me to?</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Green is Connection!</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Drew</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">On Fri, September 21, 2007 12:41, Carl Romanelli wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Hi Drew,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Quick question, if you can answer it: What is the California Green</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Party position (if any) regarding the proposal to award electoral</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">votes by congressional district, rather than winner take all?</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">I really like the congressional district idea, as I see it as a way for</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Greens to gain electoral votes with the right candidate.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Thanks if you can help. Actually, thanks even if you can't help.</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Peace,</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Carl</DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">_______________________________________________</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">gpus-del mailing list</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="mailto:gpus-del@lists.cagreens.org">gpus-del@lists.cagreens.org</A></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="http://lists.cagreens.org/mailman/listinfo/gpus-del">http://lists.cagreens.org/mailman/listinfo/gpus-del</A></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><A href="http://cagreens.org/delegates/">http://cagreens.org/delegates/</A></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Have You Hugged Your Delegate Today?</DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></SPAN></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>