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Hi, John, et al.: <br>
<br>
<br>
The Move To Amend web site lists three items, of which only
the first clearly needs constitutional attention: <br>
<br>
<br>
* Money is not speech and a corporation is not a
person. <br>
<br>
<br>
* Guarantee the right to vote to natural persons, etc.
<br>
<br>
<br>
* Protect local communities against illegitimate
"preemption" actions by global, national, and state governments.<br>
<br>
<br>
Can anyone explain to me why the second and third bullets are
here? I'm with John: Tampering with the latter two of these three
could open the door to nice sounding changes that could be worse
than the problems they are attempting to fix -- and could reduce the
appeal of a proposed amendment making easier for big money to defeat
it. <br>
<br>
<br>
However, I'm confused with John's talk of a constitutional
convention: Has Move To Amend suggested that? I have not seen
that. If it were proposed, I think it would be a bad idea. <br>
<br>
<br>
Spencer <br>
<br>
<br>
On 8/27/2011 8:42 PM, John Thielking wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:1314502942.32590.YahooMailNeo@web111112.mail.gq1.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
<div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:times
new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt">
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><span style="RIGHT: auto">My objection
is that we are even considering a Constitutional Amendment
that includes the third point in the proposed amendment.
Such an amendment would allow local fiefdoms to write their
own constitution and the national constitution could become
largely irrelevant. This is a bludgeon to fix the problems
caused by NAFTA when a scalpel is what is needed.<var
id="yui-ie-cursor"></var><br style="RIGHT: auto"
class="yui-cursor">
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times,
serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times,
serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><font face="Arial" size="2">
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></b>
Caroline Yacoub <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:carolineyacoub@att.net"><carolineyacoub@att.net></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b> John
Thielking <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:pagesincolor@yahoo.com"><pagesincolor@yahoo.com></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b>
Saturday, August 27, 2011 6:52 PM<br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[GPSCC-chat] Move To Amend and the Tea Party<br>
</font><br>
<div style="RIGHT: auto" id="yiv509965767">
<style type="text/css"><!--#yiv509965767 DIV {margin:0px;}--></style>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times,
serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div>I think your first objection is why we are going
for a constitutional amendment.<br>
</div>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york,
times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><br>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york,
times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><font face="Tahoma"
size="2">
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></b>
John Thielking <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:pagesincolor@yahoo.com"><pagesincolor@yahoo.com></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b>
Spencer Graves
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:spencer.graves@prodsyse.com"><spencer.graves@prodsyse.com></a>; Post South SF
Bay discuss <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sosfbay-discuss@cagreens.org"><sosfbay-discuss@cagreens.org></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b>
Fri, August 26, 2011 10:53:00 PM<br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b>
Re: [GPSCC-chat] Move To Amend and the Tea Party<br>
</font><br>
<div style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff; FONT-FAMILY:
times new roman, new york, times, serif; COLOR:
#000; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div><span>I don't like the part of the move to
amend that includes giving more local control
to cities and states. This would open the door
for going backwards on civil rights (Roe V
Wade, Immigration, Desegregation) because
after the amendment is passed every little
fiefdom will then adopt their own version of
civil rights law. If local control of such
laws is upheld, we will end up with an
avalanche of ALEC sponsored local legislation
that will set us back a century or more. Not
all national laws are bad or sponsored by
corporations and we should remember that.
Getting the Tea Party involved is bad for the
same reason. They will surely push the local
control amendment to further their own agenda.
The first two points to amend are good and we
should keep those. Keep in mind that calling
a constitutional convention in our current
political climate is highly dangerous because
the corporations will surely hijack it for
their own ends, negating any good things we
might try to introduce. Good luck.</span></div>
<div><span></span> </div>
<div><span>John Thielking<var
id="yiv509965767yui-ie-cursor"></var></span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new
york, times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new
york, times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><font
face="Arial" size="2">
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></b>
Spencer Graves
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:spencer.graves@prodsyse.com"><spencer.graves@prodsyse.com></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b>
Post South SF Bay discuss
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sosfbay-discuss@cagreens.org"><sosfbay-discuss@cagreens.org></a><br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b>
Friday, August 26, 2011 7:43 PM<br>
<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b>
[GPSCC-chat] Move To Amend and the Tea Party<br>
</font><br>
<div id="yiv509965767">Hello, All: <br>
<br>
<br>
The Tea Party Patriots, Inc. [ a
social welfare organization organized under
section 501(c)(4) of the Internal Revenue
Code] distributed an announcement for the
August 12 Move to Amend NY Tour event in
Endicott, NY (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.teapartypatriots.org/BlogPostView.aspx?id=d57555fb-c40b-4124-9f38-4866368f4f7f"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.teapartypatriots.org/BlogPostView.aspx?id=d57555fb-c40b-4124-9f38-4866368f4f7f</a>).
The announcement says, "Information will be
provided about the issue and facilitate a
discussion about local action in your area
and in communities across the United States
to win the amendment campaign through
grassroots mobilization." <br>
<br>
<br>
One blogger claims that Move To Amend
leader David 'Cobb is crossing ideological
lines by teaming up with Tea Party members
to make this "move" a reality.'
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gdaeman.blogspot.com/2010/01/move-to-amend.html">http://gdaeman.blogspot.com/2010/01/move-to-amend.html</a>)
<br>
<br>
<br>
I suggest we try to contact a local
Tea Party group to see if they are
interested in supporting in some way the
Sept. 12 event. The Koch brothers, who
reportedly are providing most of the
financing for the Tea Party, might not
support Move To Amend, though I would not
rule that out either. However if half the
audience on Sept. 12 is from the Tea Party,
I think most would support the idea. If
some corporation pays someone to try to
disrupt the event, it could backfire on
them. <br>
<br>
<br>
Spencer <br>
<br>
<br>
<pre class="yiv509965767moz-signature">--
Spencer Graves, PE, PhD
President and Chief Technology Officer
Structure Inspection and Monitoring, Inc.
751 Emerson Ct.
San José, CA 95126
ph: 408-655-4567
web: <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="yiv509965767moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.structuremonitoring.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.structuremonitoring.com</a>
</pre>
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</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Spencer Graves, PE, PhD
President and Chief Technology Officer
Structure Inspection and Monitoring, Inc.
751 Emerson Ct.
San José, CA 95126
ph: 408-655-4567
web: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.structuremonitoring.com">www.structuremonitoring.com</a>
</pre>
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